TSE Chat Room: Climategate Vs. Iraq War

me: I’m not arguing either global warming nor Iraq with you today, but I think you missed my point
Biggus: Your point was that the administration manipulated data in the same way the climate scientists did, when intelligence is nothing like a scientific pursuit.
me: no that wasn’t the point I was trying to make at all
I’m trying actually to think from your perspective
You seem to view what incidental evidence that the administration lied as peripheral to the overall point, and that it does not prove lying nor does it invalidate the validity of the overall action
with regards to Iraq
but you seem to find incidental and peripheral evidence of such in global warming science and view it as conclusive that it’s been debunked
more so conservatives in general not you maybe specifically
however you may disagree, that was my point
Biggus: I have never said it is debunked. I said it lends support to my contention that a lot of the data has been falsified or manipulated.
me: The conservagencia view it as proof
Biggus: More to the point, one is a political matter and the other, ideally, scientific.
And there is nothing that I’ve seen that indicates the administration did not talk up the most probable conclusion, that Iraq had WMD.
me: again, I’m not here to argue Iraq or Global warming, I just think people are getting overly excited about something that does not really change the overall argument being made
you may still disagree with that argument
I just don’t view how anythings changed
but I’m tired of the issue quite frankly
I’d love for it not to be true
but you at least understand what my actual point is
however you may disagree
Biggus: I just think it’s a lousy comparison.
me: you mother’s face is a lousy comparison
lovely
but a lousy comparison
Tell Mrs. James I said hello
Biggus: And if the fact that a very prominent climate research institute manipulating data doesn’t at least make your wonder if others are doing so, well, I don’t know what to say.
me: I think you want everyone of them to
have been doing so
You forget I don’t pretend to have a concrete solid opinion on the matter
Biggus: I don’t want them to do anything. I just suspect many of them are.
And agnosticism is the proper view, I think, but when one side is trying to push through massive international regulations it makes agnosticism kind of difficult.
me: most of it is grandstanding with no practical chance of passing. I mean they have 59 votes and the Democrats can hardly pass anything of merit
notice I said 59
I’m funny
and Joe Lieberman is a republican
at least Specter had the balls to give up his seniority and just go to the side he votes with
Biggus: Joe Lieberman is not a Republican. He strays from the party on like one vote a year and is vilified as a traitor.
me: it’s more than one vote now
terror, Iraq, health care
banking
Biggus: The radical nature of the congressional leadership might have something to do with that.
me: I’m not arguing causation
just the reality that he is virtually Republican
Biggus: Aren’t you on record criticizing Republicans for trying to purify their party?
me: I think there’s a bit of a difference, but you’re right I am
There’s Democrats that I think vote against the party on actual policy and not a desire to get revenge for a primary loss. People like Ben Nelson and Blanche Lincoln
I don’t want them kicked out despite occasional disagreements
Biggus: So, the “conscience of the Senate” is now a petty malcontent.
me: and Lieberman is only staying in the caucus to keep his chairmanship
You are right though, in the past he was vilified for his Iraq votes despite voting pretty party line other than that
I think that’s slowly changed over the last two years
regardless of what you think of him, he’s a fascinating figure in the history of American politics
Biggus: I don’t much care about him one way or the other.
me: like Zell Miller doing the nominating convention speech for both Bill Clinton and George W. Bush
Biggus: I think he’s not a complete socialist like a lot of the Democratic leadership, but he’s no hero of mine.
Or Social Democrat if you’d prefer to use a European movement that fits modern Democrats better.
me: or Fascist/Nazi/Communist to use Southern parlance

This entry was posted on Wednesday, December 16th, 2009 at 1:04 pm and is filed under Biggus Chat Room, History, Iraq War, Politics, World Affairs. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.